Please vote in the poll: Liberate all proprietary software on which these modules depend

[throwaway1037]

As discussed in: #291 these modules depend on proprietary software.
These are:

• gsp.bin
• Those in the Linux-firmware repo.
  See also: PMU Firmware #277.
• I recently discovered there are proprietary binary blobs included in source files: Inlined proprietary binary blobs in code files #286.
• The userspace binaries from the proprietary driver.

The driver requires all of these components to work.

Without the firmware from Linux-firmware, core features like reclocking will not function, which hindered Nouveau for years.
It's also (virtually) impossible to replace them by reverse-engineering because they are signed and the GPU will refuse to load firmware which is not signed by nVidia.

OS distributions such as Parabola GNU+Linux-libre use Linux-libre, a version of Linux without blobs, and does not distribute blobs.
In essence, without all the software on which these modules depend also being free software, this awesome free software driver release is crippled in the free world, as it relies on proprietary binaries.

I started this poll at the recommendation of @PAR2020 in: #291.

If you want to send the message to NVIDIA that we want our freedom, please vote "Yes" in the poll.
Thank you!

[YusufKhan-gamedev]

I voted yes but thats NOT THE POINT!

If you wish you can disassemble the blobs(that you can! Some blobs are illegal to disassemble) but AMD and intel and Qualcomm etc ALL HAVE PROPRIETARY FIRMWARE your cpu has proprietary firmware, run sudo rm -rf /lib/firmware if you wish to remove them! Be warned your computer might brick!

[YusufKhan-gamedev]

CPU microcode is mutable you can update it....

[throwaway1037]

No, the microcode is burnt into ROM.
All the microcode update bundles that exist at the moment are proprietary software.

[DemiMarie]

@throwaway1037 you are missing the point: on x86 the only options are either more bugs (built-in microcode) or fewer bugs (updated microcode). If you want a fully libre system your only option is POWER9 but that is very expensive.

[aviallon]

In my country it is never illegal to disassemble firmware blobs, so I do not care.

[arisu3]

Microcode updates are more like complex, encrypted configuration files. They aren't directly executable and they can't make arbitrary changes to the CPU's behavior. Microcode is only software in the loosest sense.

[Evernow]

There is no benefit to the consumer for this. There hasn't been any hardware that has libre firmware since 4th gen Intel.

[YusufKhan-gamedev]

1. My point was that there is no source code to what the opcodes are in a CPU just like there is no source code for the "blobs" in the free nouveau firmware.

Those firmwares you linked to have nothing to do with these modules.

You complained there wasnt a way to use NVIDIA with free firmware, I showed you it, you said it wasnt free even though linux-libre includes them.

It can't be possible for someone to know so much about tech but get so much wrong.

Same to you Mr. throwaway, im not spending much time on this thread because your a troll(hence my grammer).

[throwaway1037]

1. My point was that there is no source code to what the opcodes are in a CPU just like there is no source code for the "blobs" in the free nouveau firmware.

You're once again conflating hardware and software.

Those firmwares you linked to have nothing to do with these modules.

You complained there wasnt a way to use NVIDIA with free firmware, I showed you it, you said it wasnt free even though linux-libre includes them.

Once again you're missing the point.
It doesn't matter if there is a minimal amount of supposedly free firmware for Tegra, the issue is that proprietary firmware is required to use the cards we are discussing.
If Linux-libre includes those Tegra blobs, then either they are actually libre or you should report this as a bug.
I never claimed they were proprietary, I said they are proprietary if there is no source and that the best way to have the repo set up is for them to be built at build-time instead of hardcoded as hex arrays.

[YusufKhan-gamedev]

1. No, your conflating hardware and software, the "blobs" are as much peices of hardware as opcodes are, in fact they are kinda opcodes.
2. Just because it works on tegra doesnt mean it only works on tegra, it works on 4xx-7xx GPUs, and you did claim they were proprietary:

This file for instance is just binary blobs disguised as source code in the form of long hex arrays

No, the firmware is proprietary.

[throwaway1037]

1. No, your conflating hardware and software, the "blobs" are as much peices of hardware as opcodes are, in fact they are kinda opcodes.

Software blobs are not hardware.

2. Just because it works on tegra doesnt mean it only works on tegra, it works on 4xx-7xx GPUs,

Which are irrelevant to this discussion, which concerns cards that use these modules.

and you did claim they were proprietary:

This file for instance is just binary blobs disguised as source code in the form of long hex arrays

They may have been generated from libre source code and as such are libre.

No, the firmware is proprietary.

That was referring to the Linux-firmware repo blobs.

I'm tired of correcting your misinformation and trolling, so I'm not going to reply to any more of your nonsense.
Go away.

[YusufKhan-gamedev]

The libre firmware found in linux-libre and linux(the source code, not the firmware repo) is 100% free, the hex arrays are not proprietary as they are hardcoded onto the GPU and do not have a source form so they are hardware(in your definition). You can use nvidia gpus with nouveau without firmware anyway, you just wont get the absolute best performance. If you wish, remove firmware loading from this repo and fork it, otherwise just use nouveau with linux-libre(If you have a nouveau card).

[princesstwi]

I voted yes even though i don't think this poll will be convencing enough for nvidia. Like the other comments say, not even intel or amd open source their firmware.
What i want to see most of all is open source userspace so the mesa team can develop a more powetful nouveau

[throwaway1037]

That is in the fourth bullet point.
See also why "open source" misses the point.

[princesstwi]

Just pointing out tegra isn't for desktop. It is for arm devices like switch and tablets. If anyone else reads this please disreguard anyone who says tegra is the same.
"Cough, tesla, cough."

[YusufKhan-gamedev]

The firmware I showed was not just for tegra, it was for all nvidia devices 4xx-7xx and its mainline

[ghost]

[YusufKhan-gamedev]

Or at least provide a stable firmware ABI and document it

[64kramsystem]

Vote with your wallet (I did), and buy AMD if you don't like Nvidia's model.

[arisu3]

I understand the purpose of keeping the GSP closed. Even according to the strictest definitions of free software, binary blobs are not necessarily problematic as they are not running on your system.

But the closed userspace components should absolutely be released. I also think the GSP firmware should be released, but I think there is a 0% chance of that happening. I think there is a non-zero chance of userspace components being opened one day, which is why I voted yes.