Clarifying the Etymology and Phonetics of “Rowbal”

[C4862]

In my research and personal heritage, the surname Rowbal does not originate from Spanish linguistic or cultural roots, as some online sources (e.g., Google Search results) currently suggest. Instead, Rowbal stems from Central European ancestry, specifically Polish, Romanian, Bohemian, and Czechoslovakian lineages.

From a linguistic standpoint, misunderstandings about the phonetic structure of the name may have contributed to this misclassification. The "W" and "Y" sounds, although both classified as approximants or semi-vowels, are not interchangeable nor analogous to uvular consonants. Their articulation points and roles within various phonologies differ significantly.

This discussion aims to highlight not only the need for more accurate surname classification in digital databases but also the importance of respecting linguistic ontology and etymological authenticity when interpreting names across languages and cultures.

[jiru]

There are not any Rowbals in Tatoeba yet, but you are welcome to contribute in the form of example sentences and translations.

Textual translation of names is certainly difficult. Should we translate based on the text or the sound? If you keep the original name as-is in the translation, chances are readers of the target language will read it in a way that does not match the original language pronunciation (or won’t be able to read it at all, if the language script is different). On the other hand, if you make up a name in the target language to make it sound like in the original language, the translated name often gets weird or even ridiculous.

[C4862]

Thanks for raising these points, @jiru. My instinct is that we should preserve the original “Rowbal” spelling for cultural and etymological accuracy, plus provide a phonetic guide so readers can actually pronounce it. For example:

Keep the entry as Rowbal

Add an IPA line like Pronunciation: /ˈrɔb.al/ (or your preferred respelling)

In non-Latin scripts, show the original in Latin letters + a transliteration in the target script

This way we honour the true Central-European heritage of the name while giving clear pronunciation hints. Let me know if Tatoeba already has a standard for adding IPA or respellings—otherwise I can propose a new “Pronunciation” field to keep everything consistent.

[C4862]

• text: Rowbal
  language: eng
  pronunciation: "/ˈrɔb.al/|ROB-ahl/"
  tags:
  • proper name
    …
• text: Rowbal
  language: eng
  pronunciation: "/ˈrɔb.al/|ROB-ahl/"
  sentences:
  • eng: "Have you met Rowbal?"
    jpn: "ロバルさんに会った？"

[C4862]

Would love to hear thoughts on naming conventions (e.g., should the field be pronunciation or ipa?), formatting standards (IPA only vs. IPA+respelling), and any existing Tatoeba guidelines we should align with.

[alanfgh]

The fact that you ask about existing Tatoeba guidelines is great, because it is important for contributors to maintain the nature of the site. However, the rest of your discussion makes me think you're not familiar with Tatoeba. The sentences that are contributed to Tatoeba do not deal with individual surnames. Nor does the site have any focus on pronunciation. Our GitHub discussions are focused on the site. If you're looking for a substantive linguistic discussion about surnames, linguistic ontology, and etymological authenticity, you'll have more luck elsewhere, such as Reddit. I see that they have the forums ("subreddits") https://www.reddit.com/r/linguistics/ and https://www.reddit.com/r/asklinguistics/, and you can undoubtedly find others that are even better suited to your interests.