XLibre
Wiki-Page "Are We XLibre Yet?" #268
Replies: 13 comments 44 replies
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@BecketTocci Thank you for marking GDM as working on this page! A question: Do you use Gnome as well or something else? I'm asking because then GNOME could also be marked as working. |
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Hold up, just found out I wasn't actually running Xlibre. Be prepared to revoke that change. I just got the actual display working fine, input drivers are the problem now. |
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How could one not be running on XLibre? 😆😉 Just kidding. Update the page or me. If you need help, just tell me. |
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I'm sorry, but I've switched back to X.org for now. When, say, an Ubuntu PPA is made, I might try to switch again. I'll keep experimenting on my VM, however. I do know that GDM at least displays, and I wasn't able to get input drivers working anyways, but I think it's safe to say that it works. Thank you for your time. |
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Thank you and you're welcome! I'll give you a ping once a PPA is ready. |
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Thank you. |
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@hendrack Thank you for marking TDE and TDM as working on this page! A question: Is TDM generally capable of supporting both systemd and elogind? I'm asking because then the comment about this could be removed, as this support is now pretty much standard. |
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I haven't tried with systemd, but the Gentoo ebuild has a systemd USE flag, so it should. TDM has no USE flag for elogind, but it works by adapting the TDM pam.d file for elogind and I have a seat after login and XDG_RUNTIME_DIR is set correct. I am not sure if this USE flag is even relevant at compile time and is just the PAM file. TDE libraries have an elogind USE flag though. |
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Ok, thank you! I wasn't even aware of the TDE Gentoo overlay since it is not listed in the Gentoo Overlays... But yes, looking at the TDM ebuild it should work with systemd. 👍 I will adjust the wiki page. |
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I would like to fundamentally revise the Are We XLibre Yet? · X11Libre/xserver Wiki page to make it more readable and understandable. One major change would be to get rid of the "XLibre Support" columns in the tables that state "Supportive" or "Not supportive" or "Unclear" and replace them by the respective status icons only. To me the columns are relicts from the initial version and now a bit redundant since we have the different headings and introductionary paragraphs above each section. What I would like to do is best shown by an example of the first three sections: DistributionsFirst-party supportThe maintainers of the distribution created packages for XLibre themselves and maintain them.
Third-party supportThere is a third-party repository hosting and maintaining XLibre packages.
No supportThe maintainers of the distribution expressed concerns about packaging XLibre, do not want to add it or removed X11.
Your distribution of choice does not support XLibre? Then please have a look at our 💬 XLibre on Other Distributions Discussion. I think this is way more easier to read and gets the message across quickly and concise. @probonopd What do you think? |
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Really like it. If you really wanted to go to town, you could separate "support available" vs. "support announced" for first-party and third-party. |
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For sure I want to go to town! 😆 But separating the sections even more would be a bit overkill in my opinion so I tagged the announcements of support where appropriate. Overall: done. |
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So, I made the change instinctively. But should we supply notes about desktop environment teams having made public statements that they intend to drop X11 support? On the TDE section, it notes that there are no public plans for Wayland support. |
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Thank you for pointing this out! It is quite deeply buried in their docs and hard to spot.
Yes, absolutly! This page is to inform all XLibre users about what works, what doesn't work, and what may or may not work in the future, so that they can make an informed decision about where to “put their money.” Given your information I'm moving Enlightenment to the "Unclear future X11 support" section. |
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@fredvs Following your question in https://github.com/orgs/X11Libre/discussions/194#discussioncomment-13960022:
I've updated the page as you can see in https://github.com/X11Libre/xserver/wiki/Are-We-XLibre-Yet%3F/_compare/4cc75ccfa956824b8067786923b041c9894334e2...5fa8df85b69083e4774daf039483eadd391b9834 . Does that make things clearer, or what would you expect? |
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Update on Void Linux Abby also said something similar when i asked on github what the plan for the default XFCE iso will be moving forward (Mentioned that xfce supports wayland) then she locked the github thread as off topic as you linked on the are we xlibre page Not mad or anything i'm just pointing out that it really does seem like the plan for void linux is once XFCE wayland support is in a working state they intend on dropping x11 altogether |
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Every attempt i've made to get answers from abby or any void linux maintainer gets shut down instantly |
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Ok, thank you! I suggest to keep Void Linux in the "Unclear" state and accept:
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Can Void be updated to Hostile? They'll delete and ban any account on their officially maintained subredit that even mentions xlibre. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-cpqd9T2rCg |
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Nah supported means supported., whether or not they want Xlibre supported |
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“Hostile” is an opinion. I think it's great that we refrain from opinions and speculation on this page and strive to list only facts. Regarding the deletion of the screenshot of XLibre running on Void Linux in the Void Linux subreddit r/voidlinux, there was a discussion at Is Void Linux a pro-censorship distro ? · void-linux/void-packages · Discussion #57083. But that was and is really only about the screenshot. To my knowledge, the current state of information regarding XLibre support on Void Linux is correctly reflected on the page. |
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The Arch Linux Devs have removed our supported Xlibre packages from their AUR. |
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Did they just revert that? I can find it in AUR |
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Everything is still in place: https://aur.archlinux.org/packages?O=0&SeB=nd&K=xlibre-x&outdated=&SB=p&SO=d&PP=50&submit=Go as it should be. I'm reverting the page to the AUR is in the "Third-party support" state. |
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@BecketTocci Regarding your changes in https://github.com/X11Libre/xserver/wiki/Are-We-XLibre-Yet%3F/_compare/a0010186ebecfea7864e86a8af15b906abccb84a...c7c767e7eb18029b2f447e8d24a635c2a1128e52 : The page has some logic to it:
These things are not wrritten down, so I did now to document at least part of it. |
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I would like to suggest that we proceed with caution in such cases of suspicion. Let's ask first before assuming that someone is hostile towards us. Since I can still find the packages of the XLibre maintainers, I assume that they are still included in the AUR. If not, we should first set the status to “Unclear” and establish direct communication. I know that everyone's nerves are a little frayed, but let's please act cautiously and prudently. |
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The packages are visible again; no communication(?) |
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@pugly-tech Thank you for your change "Distinguishing between Ubuntu and Ubuntu Desktop; as Ubuntu is the source for many X11 distros and most of the Ubuntu flavors still rely on X11, while Ubuntu Desktop is the distro with GNOME that is removing wayland support" in https://github.com/X11Libre/xserver/wiki/Are-We-XLibre-Yet%3F/b976ecef3eddc3c13638495180b58e8c48c24737. IMO we could add more of the Ubuntu spins like Lubuntu, Xubuntu etc. Would you like to do some of the research and add the results? |
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It might take me some time as I'm gearing up for a big camping trip next weekend. I might as well, but it gets to the point where if I'm doing that I should also do downstream distros like Linux Mint, Zorin OS, KDE Neon, and so on. And while that will extend the list of supported distros considerably it might be seen as padding as they're all relying on the same Xlibre repositories with little to no changes. But it might be helpful to have a long list where people can find their distro without having to look up what the upstream distro is to theirs. |
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Thank you and no pressure (literally).
I was thinking about this as well. On the one hand it may be seen as padding but on the other hand is it known that some people sometimes have problems with abstraction. So it may be worth it to list all the downstream distros. And I tend to opt for the latter. But only listing the ones which have been tested. Either by us or a trustworthy third party. |
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@Jeyso215 I have seen your edit regarding the Solus project in Compare revisions · X11Libre/xserver Wiki. Thank you for your contribution! After reading Switch to X11Libre - Solus Forum as well as June 2025 project status update · AerynOS · Discussion #50 there is no indication that that the Solus project team members themselves describe the XLibre project as close to conspiracy theories. The comment https://github.com/orgs/AerynOS/discussions/50#discussioncomment-13551850 you quoted was made by "someone on the internet". A contributor but IMO no official statement. The sentiment of the Solus project team members is more along the lines of “let's wait and see” - if you want to interpret it positively. They are also concerned that the desktop environments they use (Budgie, Gnome and KDE) have discontinued X11 support. In my opinion, the latter is a valid argument. I would suggest putting Solus in the “Unclear” category. |
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Oh i forgot to mention AveryOS is same original developer of GetSolus and solus-project. The community know solus/aerynos are affiliates with each other. |
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I am currently on XFCE via Solus which uses x.org (X11), which i hope they won't remove, and hopefully will adapt to X11Libre. |
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Thank you for your correction of Solus OS and addition of AerynOS. I sorted their entries alphabetically and improved the formatting a little bit. |
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I will not speak for Linux From Scratch (LFS) or its editors, although I am one myself. However, from what I know, XLibre for LFS is in the "we'll wait and see" side of things per https://lists.linuxfromscratch.org/sympa/arc/blfs-dev/2025-06/msg00045.html. On that thread, I mentioned that Supplemental LFS (a third party and community maintained book installing various packages on an LFS system) has XLibre support axed for different reasons. I'm personally against its addition for now but will definitely reconsider in a year or two. In short, I believe the stance for Linux From Scratch is "we'll wait and see". If anyone wants to put that in the list, go ahead! |
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@Zeckmathederg The commit X11Libre: Archived. Fixes #191. · glfs-book/slfs@1cec1a5 states:
Do you know which things got broken? We would like to fix them if possible. |
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Would it make sense to make a distinction between technical support and developer support? For example Xlibre has been ported to Void Linux and works well, but the developers are actively hostile to the project to the point that they ban people for mentioning Xlibre. And we can point out things tangentially related, like how it seems Pastebin banned a user for uploading Xlibre debugging logs |
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There is and will be no "Hostile" section. In my opinion, it does us no good to be outraged about anything and let ourselves be guided by emotions. Please see my comment https://github.com/orgs/X11Libre/discussions/268#discussioncomment-14379740 for the reasoning behind this. Is there any new information in this regard besides what is already stated in this comment? Are there any links, etc., where the developers of Void Linux have explicitly stated their position? |
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That's fine, i just respectfully disagree. Considering the people working on this are being called ww2 Germans. And Sept 10th shows they're serious. It's not really that far of a jump for them to be 'we won't even tolerate third parties adding it so we're adding sabotage code'. |
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Has this been done by any of the Void Linux maintainers? If so, please provide a source to quote.
I understand that some events in contemporary history can be disturbing. If you feel threatened, please seek advice and support from those around you, as we are unable to provide this here. The focus of this wiki page is on the availability of XLibre. The focus of the overall project is the development of an X display server. |
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No, though considering what happened on the 10th stuff like this. https://x.com/LundukeJournal/status/1942269768192737511 The one thing one should take from the event, if they call you something. keep in mind they're telling you what they think. they're not being hyperbolic or childish. |
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The case you describe happened a long time ago and has been documented in Record changes of some guys on the distro support wiki page · Issue #346 · X11Libre/xserver and e.g. has been covered in the video you mentioned too. In my opinion, it doesn't help the project to continue to stick to it. |
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@Kingproone Unfortunately, I had to undo your changes to the page. Reasons:
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Sorry for making so many edits that fell through, tried to keep them seperated enough.
I understand people like it in differing ways, thats why I left both links to the github and the aur as well (even though the discussion link has both), maybe more desription could be added to differentiate the link entries.
I didn't realise these entries had that type of differentiation - to sort tested entries (the Desktop environments have this)
I can fully see you point, of people expecting a more out of box/ matured experience. |
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@Kingproone I am sorry as well as the logic of the page may be a bit hidden, especially for some new contributors.
The aim is to keep the information very compact and easy to understand without sacrificing its essence and informational content. Taking that into account, what could be improved in the description under the points “All Arch Distros”/“Arch Linux AUR”?
Experience shows that we are asked whether XLibre is also available on CachyOS, for example. Of course, this could be deduced, but these questions still arise. We want to make it as easy as possible for our users to find their distribution of choice in the list and use XLibre on it.
I really like this idea! For the "Distributions" section there already is the distinction between first-party and third-party support which I would like to keep in order to, well, keep things simple. Up until now we marked any work in progress with a 🏗️ icon and provided a source in the remarks. But we could indeed include a call to contribute. I am not sure whether this is applicable to the "Desktop environments" and "Display Managers" section as well since due to history they just are X11 compatible. So we only need to ensure they work on XLibre as well since almost all of them do by default. |
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The arch situation is just a bother to my eyes, having essentially 4 times as many lines as needed, maybe I'll have a good idea to clean it up. DE support could include things that are newly introduced features in xlibre compared to xorg, and as I gathered from articles, supporting those features would fall under the DEs, not distros. This may be a bit too technical of a differentiation to make, but could fit in as a remark that xy De supports zx xlibre feature. The wip indication: For the first party section, the work in progress emoji indicator fits nicely and in the remark there could be a mention/ ask for testers. The checkmark is a strong indication that it is already prime time supported, so the below edit woudl have another reason (at least in my eyes) to stick. 
but for the third party section it kinda clashes with the description, so ideas: If you would leave the third party section as-is, then either there could be a new table above/under the current one that only has the WIP distros and its own description above it. (I like this one better, since it only introduces one completely new table, but the deduplication of calling for help in option 3 feels like a good idea too, that could be added to the 1st party description as well) Or a new main section under something like 'Upcoming support' with two tables. or or option 3: one-one new table in both first and 3rd party sections with their own description including the call for help, that way the remark columns could be kept cleaner/ deduplicated from the same ask for help. |
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Yes, it might bother your eyes. We alltogether have to serve a very wide user base with very different technical skills so we have to make compromises and resort to some very simply, to someone maybe redundant solutions. Also mind you that the table is a simple key value "store": The distribution name is the key, the remark the value containing a link to the package source/tutorial and if applicable a discussion. So the users can lookup their distribtion by just scanning the first column. That is what is important to them. If there is a duplication in the remarks, then the solution is maybe more universal. For example we will add some Arch Linux, Debian and Ubuntu variants in the future as well once we have a verification they work so there may be more duplication of remarks but still: The distribution is the key.
This kind of "feature matrix" could become very complex and I don't see the benefits outweighing this complexity. Our approach is: "It works in general and most edge cases too." Any non-working stuff will be dealt with in the issues section.
Yes, the ✅ indicator is a strong one and its use has a historical background when there was no distinction like "Announced ..." etc. We could rework the "First-party support" table like in your suggestion and my additons:
Please, no new table since "Work in progress" is a sub-attribute of "First-party" and "Third-party". Therefore I would like to (re-) use the very same structure as for the first-party support and mark work in progress as in the example given in the above answer. This would be one sound concept for the whole page IMO. |
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This is the discussion thread of the wiki page "Are We XLibre Yet?". If you are unsure whether to add something or make a change to the page, just talk about it. You can also leave a message if you see something that is not quite right or you are planning a major change.
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